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         May 22, 2023 Study Session...



         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Special Study Session, May 22nd.

         I would like to welcome everybody here.  We also have people in

    an overflow room, so we will have everything televised there also,

    but if anybody is in the overflow room and you walk slowly and

    orderly, we still have some seats for you in the main room.  If

    people are sitting over there, you don't have to.

         First of all, I would just like to say thank you, everybody, for

    being here.  This current board is going to be faced with some

    decision in the future about what happens to our properties north of

    the Downtown Campus.

         No decision has been made.  Discussions have happened but nothing

    is in stone.  We're not sure what we want to do.  We haven't seen all

    of the possibilities yet.  The reason we are having this meeting

    today is because a lot of you have information, knowledge, and

    expertise that we would like you to share with the board so when we

    make our decision we're fully informed.  So thank you for being here.

         I was faculty, as many of you know, and in 2017 when these

    properties were purchased, I went before All Faculty Day and I stood

    up and I made a statement saying that why are we buying properties

    when we're in a financial not-positive situation at the college.  We

    hadn't had salary raises for a long time.  I was frustrated and

    upset.

         So I understand what everybody is here for.  You're here to give





    your impression and your experience and your knowledge.  So we're

    going to limit it to three minutes, and we are expecting everybody to

    follow that time limit.  Then also, we want to have everybody be, if

    you're not speaking, if you're in the audience, be an active

    listener, make sure you're hearing what the speaker is saying, see

    how that melds with your idea, and then when it's your turn to talk,

    if someone has already spoken almost exactly the same words that you

    were planning on speaking, you might not need to use your whole three

    minutes and maybe save your time for somebody else who would like to

    speak if we go beyond -- you know, we're going to end this meeting

    also at 6:00, so we have two hours to speak.

         Lastly, let's be respectful of everybody.  The board received

    lots of e-mails.  Many of us responded to as many as we could, and we

    appreciate when they are polite and when you share ideas and options

    with us.  It's not fun when people say that we've committed crimes

    and broke the laws and decide whatever.  So just let's remember

    everybody be positive and supportive of the board and the people who

    are up here speaking.  So thank you in advance.

         Also -- oh, yeah, that's right.  So we do have presentations.

    Thrive in the 05 initiative will be our first presenter.

         >> Good afternoon, board members.  My name is Ann Chanecka.  I am

    a deputy director of the Department of Housing and Community

    Development for the City of Tucson.  I'm here to give a very, very

    brief overview about Thrive in the 05 and some updates in particular

    that relate to what you're talking about today.





         I always like my crutch of a few slides (smiles).

         Okay.  So for those that aren't as familiar, a super-quick

    overview of what Thrive in the 05 is.  In 2018, three different

    collaboratives, three different initiatives came together to form a

    collaboration.  One of them, the ASU School of Social Work got a

    grant focused on crime and public safety.  Us at the city got a grant

    from Housing and Urban Development called a Choice Neighborhoods

    grant.  After an outgrowth of Daniel Rose Fellowship, Pima Community

    College and the City's Office of Economic Initiatives really put

    together a focused workforce and economic development initiative for

    the Thrive in the 05.

         So I do want to say thank you so much to Pima Community College.

    You have been an incredible partner for the past five years working

    on the Thrive in the 05 collaborative and really appreciate the time

    and energy and resources you have been putting into that effort.

         Throughout the three years of planning -- there was three years

    of planning and then the pandemic started, and it was more of service

    delivery.  Throughout that time, though, what we listened really

    intently to neighborhood groups, stakeholders, nonprofits, and we

    summarized what we heard in a Thrive in the 05 transformation plan

    that's available on the city's website, it really outlines what we

    heard for Thrive in the 05 area.

         So summarizing many, many years of planning into one slide, there

    were countless festivals, charrettes, open houses.  We have been

    paying community ambassadors to help us with engagement, really





    wanting to hear from the community what do they want for Thrive in

    the 05.  And Thrive in the 05 in terms of boundaries on the south end

    is more or less Speedway, so Pima Community College Downtown campus

    on the south end, Stone on the east end, I-10 on the west end.

         Not going to read all this, but this is part of the

    transformation plan.  There are four key areas, and workforce and

    economic development and really trying to integrate what Pima

    Community College is doing is one of those four areas.

         Then a couple more recent updates, so our planning grant we

    received in 2018 also came with action activity monies.  And those

    are smaller projects to jump-start implementation.  So one of them,

    if you have been along Drachman Avenue recently, you may have seen

    the Historic Miracle Mile signage that's going up.  As part of those

    action activities, HUD has given us money to do more branding along

    the whole Drachman, Oracle, and Miracle Mile Historic Gateway.

         This January, feels like it was a long time ago at this point,

    but it was this year, we submitted a grant application to Housing and

    Urban Development.  This is the Choice Neighborhoods implementation

    grant.  It's a $50 million grant.  So we submitted it in January.

         We will find out whether or not we are getting this grant in

    July.  Good news is Tucson is a finalist for consideration.  They

    publicly announced those last month, and we are still not guaranteed.

    So there are still more finalists than there are grants available.

         If we do get the grant, it's an eight-year grant, so we have

    eight years to deliver what we wrote and put in our grant





    application.  Then even though it sounds like a lot of money and it

    is a lot of money, the majority of that grant will go towards

    rehabilitating The Tucson House.  You can imagine what that cost

    looks like.  So that's really the key focus.

         However, there are three core goals area.  There is housing, and

    that's where the majority of the funding would go.  There is services

    for folks living at The Tucson House and the other sites that we have

    proposed.  Then there is a neighborhood category.  I bring that up,

    because we proposed five projects in our grant proposal under the

    neighborhood category.

         This is my last slide.  One of them we really worked with the

    leadership of Pima Community College at the time and proposed what we

    are calling a Drachman Gateway.  So what that would be is we

    submitted a draft budget for $1,750,000 of the HUD money to really

    help build out the public access to the community hub and also the

    public plaza area of the community hub, so almost $2 million of the

    HUD funding.  And so the thinking there, and we did submit a support

    letter, a commitment letter from Pima Community College with our

    grant application, in it, there were sort of a few different

    commitments Pima Community College made.  One is having there be this

    community hub.  And in the letter it specifically talked about $8.3

    million was the minimum amount, understandably, wanted to kind of

    keep that dollar amount open.  So the letter specifically said a

    minimum of $8.3 million for the community hub.

         There would be public access, we'd be supporting that, and a





    public plaza area with the understanding some of it would have to be

    more secured, but there would be an area that would be open to the

    public.

         Really, the way the support letter is written, it talks about the

    innovation center, the center for DEI, and the center for

    entrepreneurship.  The letter also outlines how Choice works.

    Anything that's budgeted that you can show is programmed in the

    future you can count, and so the list included about $8 million of

    additional projects.  So the whole support letter was about $16

    million worth of investment from PCC to support the overall efforts.

         So I'm here.  I'm happy to answer any questions.  But at least

    wanted to give you an update on Thrive in the 05 and to help answer

    any questions.

         >> MS. MARIA GARCIA:  Okay.  So you're saying that $60 million,

    so is that --

         >> 16.

         >> MS. MARIA GARCIA:  16, 1-6.

         >> Yeah, 1-6.

         >> MS. MARIA GARCIA:  Correct.  Now, so was that money that was

    going to be committed to Pima College?

         >> It was money coming from Pima College.

         >> MS. MARIA GARCIA:  From Pima.

         >> Yeah.

         >> MS. MARIA GARCIA:  To --

         >> To the effort.  And it's really money that my understanding





    was budgeted in the PCC budget.  So not additional funding but what

    was included in the PCC budget.

         So an example, the science and technology building remodel, my

    understanding, is already budgeted for 5 million, so that's part of

    that 16 million.

         >> MS. MARIA GARCIA:  So I have a question for the chancellor.

         Thank you.

         So when did that -- so the centers of excellence, is this part of

    what she's talking about?

         >> DR. LEE LAMBERT:  This was all part of the overall

    center-of-excellence projects that we have discussed with the board

    in the past.

         >> MS. MARIA GARCIA:  I'm sorry.

         Okay.  Thank you.

         >> MR. GREG TAYLOR:  Chancellor, in terms of these commitments

    that were made in this letter, does any of this presuppose the

    adaptive reuse of those hotel buildings, or is this other projects

    separate from the hotel?  Just trying to make sure I get it straight

    in my head.

         >> DR. LEE LAMBERT:  So without going back and looking at the

    details, this is just off the top of my head, right, we factored in

    all of what we are doing in terms of the centers of excellence,

    integrating different components which this is a component of what we

    are envisioning, and so adaptive reuse of existing facilities,

    renovation of facilities were part of the overall plan.





         >> Thank you.

         >> MS. MARIA GARCIA:  Thank you.

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Thank you.

         Our next presentation is an overview of academic programs and

    student services at the Downtown Campus from Dr. Dolores Duran-Cerda,

    provost, and Nina Corson, the campus vice president of the Downtown

    Campus.  Thank you.

         >> DR. DOLORES DURAN-CERDA:  Thank you.  Good afternoon, Chair

    Riel, Vice-Chair McLean, members of the board, Chancellor Lambert,

    colleagues and guests.

         I'm here.  I'm the provost and executive vice-chancellor for

    academic affairs, and accompanying me is our Downtown Campus Vice-

    President Nina Corson.

         We will be giving a little bit of context of the academic

    offerings that are taking place at the Downtown Campus.  So first

    I'll pass it off to Nina.

         >> NINA CORSON:  Thank you.  Dolores and I are going to kind of

    bounce back and forth and hope to give you an overview of the campus.

         So Pima Community College's Downtown Campus is in the heart of

    Tucson, right at the cross-streets of a major intersection at

    Speedway and Stone.  It is our second-largest in-person campus, and

    we have served over 4,200 individual learners this academic year with

    almost 10,000 enrollments.

         Our Downtown Campus now has approximately 400,000 square feet of

    space and use across 14 buildings.  These numbers do not include the





    newly acquired Catholic Social Service buildings.  Nor do they

    include the hotel properties we are speaking of today.

         Our Downtown Campus has that cool urban vibe with classes going

    from 7:00 a.m. in the morning until 10:00 p.m. at night.  It is the

    perfect blend of old and new.

         In fact, the photo that you're looking at I took last week up on

    the third floor of the brand-new, state-of-the-art Advanced

    Manufacturing Building, yet is focuses on the 102-year-old Roosevelt

    Building.

         Our student population is diverse.  Though the majority of our

    learners are traditionally aged, the Downtown Campus has a larger

    percentage of learners over 40 than any other campus.

         Last fall those 40-and-over made up about 11% of our head count.

    The Downtown Campus is also near several centers of refugee

    populations, and it is not uncommon to hear four or five different

    languages spoken in one day as you walk across the campus.

         We are also down the street from the University of Arizona in a

    convenient spot for those U of A students to take a class that they

    can't get at the University or that frankly they would just rather

    take from us.  Go ahead.

         >> DR. DOLORES DURAN-CERDA:  Thank you.  So the Downtown Campus

    is near and dear to me because I was a faculty member there for 10

    years, and I taught in the Roosevelt Building, world languages.

         So this academic year our faculty taught 49 disciplines at the

    Downtown Campus.  Recently we have heard about the ribbon cutting,





    about the Advanced Manufacturing Building, our center of excellence,

    the Applied Technology programs, and in these programs we offer

    automotive technology, we offer welding, automated industrial

    technology, machining, CAD, which is Computer-Aided Drafting, and

    also building and construction trades.

         One out of four Downtown Campus students is enrolled in one of

    these programs.  Our Applied Technology division includes about 30%

    of the enrollment of the campus.  70% of the Downtown Campus

    enrollment is gen eds.

         The discipline that has the most enrollment at the Downtown

    Campus is mathematics, and in addition to a host of transferable gen

    ed courses, we also, that are unique to the Downtown Campus, have an

    abundance of languages.  As Nina said, you walk down the campus, and

    you can hear a variety of languages.  We teach ESL, Chinese, French,

    Spanish, Japanese, and Korean.  We also have the translation studies

    interpretation program there.

         By large margin, the majority of our students on campus intend to

    transfer with an Associate of Arts to the University of Arizona, ASU,

    or NAU.  But our next most enrolled programs at the Downtown Campus

    are the Associate in Science for transfer, and also the Associate of

    Business Administration for transfer, as well as automotive

    technology, welding, and paralegal.

         Nina?

         >> NINA CORSON:  Okay, thanks.

         As the campus vice president, it is my goal to ensure that every





    learner on campus is provided a rich experience whether they are in

    one of the original parts of campus that you see in this photo or on

    one of our brand-new parts of campus.

         Now, since moving to the Downtown Campus last March, I have

    learned quite a bit of the campus history.  For instance, many assume

    that our original campus or original classes took place right there

    in the Roosevelt Building.  It's not true.  I see one of our board

    members knows that's not true at all.

         As it turns out, in 1974 when the campus opened, the very first

    classes took place in a remodeled post office that happens to be

    where our library is right now.  The Downtown Campus has a long

    history of adaptively reusing buildings when it made sense to do so

    or demolishing the buildings and creating something new when that

    made more sense to do so instead.

         >> DR. DOLORES DURAN-CERDA:  So at the Downtown Campus we serve

    comprehensively all students, and so we provide an array of student

    services, which includes enrollment and program advising, career

    advising, and counseling, Summer Bridge Programs, financial aid

    services, tutoring, academic support and coaching.  We also have a

    supportive veterans center and a comprehensive Student Life

    programming.

         Also at the Downtown Campus we house the adult education

    administration and the immigrant and refugee resource center as well

    as the ethnic, gender, transborder studies and sociology programs at

    the Downtown Campus.





         It is also the favorite campus location for our popular Super

    Saturday enrollment events.

         >> NINA CORSON:  As you can see, the Downtown Campus is a

    happening place and one that continually morphs.  A majority of the

    college's internal and external public and large events are held in

    the Amethyst Room.  I'm sure you've all been there.  And we have more

    and more events taking place in the new Azurite Room.  Many exciting

    changes are coming too, some that our college is leading and some

    that our community partners are leading.

         You heard just now from the Thrive in the 05 partners, but also,

    soon the Ninth Avenue Castro Bicycle Boulevard will be improved and

    run right through our campus.  There are future plans for our

    community's light-rail extension, the Tucson Norte-Sur, which

    includes a stop planned on Drachman right at the edge of our campus.

         We have long-range tentative plans to demolish the Catholic

    Social Service Building and potentially create a University-partnered

    joint-use facility at that location.  We also hope to create a

    veterans memorial park on campus, and of course we have ongoing needs

    for regular upgrades to ensure our existing older facilities are just

    as state-of-the-art as our newer facilities.

         >> DR. DOLORES DURAN-CERDA:  So I will talk a little bit about

    future plans.  So one of them is to move the workforce development

    team that's located here at District Office to the Downtown Campus as

    well as a Small Business Development Center.  The Downtown Campus

    will also accommodate expanded industry training and several





    community partnerships.

         The programs are housed in the east wing of the ST building where

    the Applied Technology staff and programs are going to be moving out

    of.  In addition, the west wing of the ST building will be renovated

    to allow much more expansion for our building and construction

    technologies program known as BCT.

         We train the community's future electricians, plumbers, HVAC

    workers, mason workers, carpenters, all in a small portion of the ST

    west building.  We will soon be able to expand the programs to allow

    the physical space necessary for those programs that are growing and

    have heavy equipment simulation.  And we will finally be able to move

    our cabinet-making program that currently is at the M&S site to the

    Downtown Campus.

         So I hope Nina and I were able to provide some context of the

    Downtown Campus, what's currently being offered and future plans, and

    we will be happy to answer any questions.

         Okay.

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Thank you both.

         >> DR. DOLORES DURAN-CERDA:  Thank you.

         Our next presentation is from Dan Maher, director of architecture

    from GLHN Architects & Engineers, on the assessment of the hotel

    properties.

         >> Thank you, all, for having me here today.  Again, my name is

    Dan Maher.  I'm the director of architecture for GLHN Architects &

    Engineers.  We were awarded the adaptive reuse project on the





    downtown hotels properties in April of 2022.

         We have been working over the course of the last year with the

    Pima Community College end users and various different groups to

    create the program that we would move forward during the design and

    construction documents phase of this project.

         >> I can't hear him.

         >> Is that better?

         >> Yes.

         >> All right.  I will give the overview there again.

         We have been engaged with Pima Community College during the

    programming phase, the head of the design and construction documents

    phase of this project.  To be clear, we have gotten this to the

    identified end users, some space planning, but we will talk a little

    bit more about that in slides moving forward here.

         We have had a number of different programming meetings with the

    identified end users from Pima Community College.  That has been a

    shifting target over the course of the last year, and we have been

    working with the Pima Community College project managers as we narrow

    down what end users would be in this facility.

         Here are some images from those meetings that we had.  We started

    with some visioning exercises as to what these properties could be.

    There was tremendous engagement from the end users as to what they

    saw the future of these properties and how it could engage with the

    community at large as well as the student body and administration as

    well.





         These are some of those images.  One of the things we do when we

    go through these programming exercises is we create heat maps and

    things like that of images that really resonate with the end users

    what they hope to see out of these facilities.  We don't really talk

    about the spaces at that point.  It's more understanding what the

    needs of the users and what the potential is.

         We had some slide decks that we worked through with very

    open-ended questions and words to understand again what they saw the

    potential for these properties to be.  Then this is the heat map that

    I discussed.

         Looking at these from just an understanding perspective of what

    items really resonated with people is essentially where we got to

    with this.

         Where we did the bulk of the heavy lift was on what we call the

    project charter.  This is the understanding of what the project would

    be for Pima Community College as our client and how we would engage

    the public and the end users, the administration, and the student

    body.  This was an important part of this process for us, and this is

    part of the documentation that we have issued to Pima Community

    College.

         The four different user groups that were identified eventually

    that would go into these properties are the innovation lab,

    diversity, equity, and inclusion, the teaching and learning center

    and also education technology.  So when we distilled this information

    we came up with gross square footages that each one of these programs





    would be using to allocate the spaces to them so that we could move

    forward with the design process.

         The slide that you're seeing here is for the innovation center.

    The teaching and learning center.  Oh, I believe actually education

    technology.  Sorry, I skipped over.  And DEI as well.

         What we derived from that were rough square footages of the

    requirements of these end users, right?  What you're seeing on the

    screen, on your screens, is the gross square footages of the

    properties themselves.

         I jumped ahead a little bit there.  At the beginning of this

    project, we were tasked with going through and creating a feasibility

    study for these properties.  This is not the first feasibility study

    that was completed.  There were two previous feasibility studies

    which addressed some of the opportunities and constraints of these

    properties for Pima Community College to use and as they saw fit.

    That's part of how we arrived at these diagrams for those properties.

         So we took the requirements of the end users and we arrived at a

    gross square footage -- it's very blurry up there -- of roughly

    14,000 square feet which were required.  As we started to overlay, we

    didn't do full test fits or anything like that, in looking at where

    these opportunities existed and presented themselves for co-location

    of these end user groups, we started understanding that the Tucson

    Inn property would probably be best suited to the innovation center.

    Education technology would be nearby, teaching and learning center,

    as these things kind of cascaded across the various different





    properties.

         Now, I should note that 14,000 square feet required by the end

    users does not come close to fitting all of the square footages of

    the three hotel properties.  Their gross square footages are in

    excess of that.

         As part of the feasibility study, we went through all of the

    properties extensively.  We did a full scan of the interior of all of

    those properties.  We did assessments of the structure of the

    interior finishes of the mechanical, electrical, and plumbing

    systems.  Essentially a full documentation.  Again, Pima Community

    College has all that documentation if you'd like to look at it more

    extensively.

         A lot of people however have not been inside these properties

    because they are closed and boarded up, so some of the images that

    you're going to see here are of the interiors there.  This is of the

    Tucson Inn.  This is the back side of the diner building.

         Structurally, for the most part, this part of the Tucson Inn is

    in fine shape.  You know, there are things that need to be done to it

    obviously, but there weren't structural deficiencies that we saw

    elsewhere throughout these buildings.

         This is the diner property there.  One of the main issues that we

    are starting to see is that there are water intrusion issues

    throughout all three property buildings.

         These images here are actually from the City of Tucson.  This is

    from when the Tucson Inn property was condemned.  There are some





    structural concerns related to where the electrical equipment sits.

         This is the back half of the Tucson Inn.  This area is not

    accessible because it's simply not safe for people to go inside.

         The Copper Cactus Inn, these buildings are in better shape, I

    would say, than especially the back half of the Tucson Inn.  They are

    in various states of repair and disrepair.  The image on the left

    there I think is important because you could essentially shower in

    that property right now but it's juxtaposed with other issues that

    they have.

         So Pima Community College has engaged with a Construction Manager

    at Risk on this project.  We have never gotten, as the design

    professional, we have never gotten to a point where there have been

    any cost estimations done at the level of drawings that we have

    produced.  What has taken place is what is happening in the

    construction market right now, which we have seen an unprecedented

    escalation across the market.

         So from a high level, the rough square footage of these

    properties multiplied by what we are seeing in the market has

    generated some of these -- these should not be referred to as cost

    estimates, or budgets.  They are simply an allocation of what

    potentially the renovation could cost.  There has been nothing that

    has been bid or designed or anything to that effect.

         I believe Brandye...

         >> Brandye:  Hi, everybody.  Chancellor Lambert, Chair Riel, the

    rest of the board members.  I wanted to real quick go over the slide





    that we talked about on April 24, just as a refresher.

         So what we are looking at here is the Downtown properties.  There

    are four options listed.  The first one would include a renovation of

    26,000 square feet and a demolition of approximately 20,000 square

    feet.

         The number that you just saw from Dan is a number that was

    produced by a national estimating firm.  So they get their

    information countrywide.  The $625 a square foot that you saw was

    actually in Phoenix, and when it was provided to us, they qualified

    it saying if you have a special-use building, then it could go as

    high as a thousand dollars a square foot.  Now, you're aware that

    many of our center-of-excellence projects are special-use buildings.

    So with the estimates that we created, we used a $650 per square foot

    number.

         So as I said, the first number, the 35.7, is the amount that we

    found for approximately 26,000 square feet renovated, 20,000 demoed.

    The funded amount that you see there, the $10 million, that's an

    allocation.  That was never intended to represent a project budget.

    Rather an amount that was set aside so that we could go through this

    process that Dan just described and then get into construction and at

    that point understand truly what the budget would be.

         I'm grateful to Dan for having qualified the project budget

    number.  It's a budget number.  Not an estimate.  Those happen after

    we've gone through design and start looking at documents.

         So the 8.9 would be the Tucson Inn sign as well as 4,000 square





    feet of renovation.  That would be the kitchen photos that Dan showed

    to you that are just below the Tucson Inn sign.

         The 17.3 would be that 4,500 square foot renovation as well as an

    additional 6,000 square feet.  When you're hearing that, you're

    hearing that those alternatives are less than the program that was

    defined.  The first option, the 35.7, is the option for all programs.

         Then the last one, the 3.6, would be to maintain the signage and

    demolish all of the structures.  I'm not sure if Dan said this, sorry

    to repeat him if he did already say this, however, the Tucson Inn,

    the back of the Tucson Inn has been declared -- gosh, the word is

    escaping me right now, but it's completely unoccupiable.  We have

    always, as was noted, considered that to be a space that would be

    demolished.

         I'm happy to take any questions.  I'll be here for the remainder.

         >> MR. GREG TAYLOR:  I will admit that math is not my strong suit

    nor nearly as well as Theresa's is.  I'm having trouble figuring out

    where that $35 million number came from.  I heard 14,000 square feet

    and even at the high end of what you were saying the estimate was,

    when I multiply that in my head, I'm getting 8 million.  I'm assuming

    8 million-something.  I'm assuming there is demolition.  Then you

    said 20,000 square feet?  I'm just trying to follow.  Can you just

    break down for me everything that's in that $35.7 million?

         >> Brandye:  Give me one second.  I will pull up a slide that has

    that information.  I'm not going to pull it up.  I don't have it in

    this computer, but I will share with you what's in it.  All right.





         So I'm going to the hotel option No. 1, and here's the exact

    numbers.  It was 26,750 square feet that would be renovated and

    22,693 that would be demolished.  If we take that approximately

    26,000 square feet and multiply it by the -- actually, we multiplied

    it by 600.  So we didn't go the full 650 on this project.  We come to

    16 million.

         Then we also have, as part of the construction, we mentioned last

    time that the infrastructure needs on this project are great.  So

    we're assigning 25% of those costs to infrastructure needs.

         Then we have abatement needs, demolition needs.  Those are

    separate costs from the number that you just heard.  Every project

    that we talk about, when we are talking about construction budgets,

    we are talking about 70% of the project cost.  Another 30% of the

    cost goes to our designers, to our engineers, to our inspectors, to

    our permit process.  We also have money that gets assigned to

    furniture, fixture and equipment, AVIT.

         Let me see what I might have missed.  Move costs.  Now we're

    getting down into the nitty-gritty.  We also like to have a project

    contingency, because as we are going through these projects,

    especially if it's an existing property, we are going to find things

    that we didn't know about.  So rather than continue to ask you for

    additional money, additional money, additional money, we like to

    include a little bit of a contingency.

         I hope that helps.

         >> MS. MARIA GARCIA:  Okay.  So Brandye, thank you so much for





    the information.  I have been asking specifically for the cost

    breakdowns, okay, because I realized from the beginning that

    originally the $10 million or 14 million that we actually budgeted

    last year, you know, did not -- it wasn't specific as to what exactly

    was going to be needed.

         I have recently built a home, so I know exactly what you're

    talking about.  Everything costs money.  And yes, materials have,

    well, tripled in cost.  Cement, plywood.

         But thank you so much for the breakdown.  You know, in order for

    the board to make a good decision on how we spend our taxpayers'

    money, including that these costs not only are going to cost the

    taxpayer but also increase in tuition, okay, so it's better for us to

    know what we are voting on.

         Thank you so much.

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Yes, thank you.

         Dan, I have a quick question.  Will you just share with the

    board, we have heard some things just casually that when you all

    -- maybe not you but maybe the city, when you were inspecting and you

    found some problems with the utilities that no one was aware of, are

    you familiar with what I'm talking about, by any chance?

         >> Can you expound on that?  Possibly.  But can you expound on

    that?

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  I thought I heard something that when they

    started looking into the buildings, they realized that in order to

    bring them up they were also going to have to do all sorts of





    upgrades to the utilities because some utilities were either buried

    in certain places that weren't legal anymore or that sort of thing.

         >> Correct.  So again, there were three different feasibility

    studies by three different design firms that have taken place on

    these properties over the years.  Almost all of us have addressed

    some of these issues.  We were simply the most recent.

         So there are two different ways to answer that.  We did look at

    it from an architectural and mechanical, electrical, and plumbing

    perspective as to what it would take to bring these buildings up to

    being occupiable and safe.  So we have noted that in our report.

         In addition to that, there are site utilities, which is what

    Brandye mentioned, that need to be addressed so that these can be

    viable.  That is something that can be done.  We have made our

    assessment of how we could do those things.  But again, it comes down

    to Pima Community College choosing to spend that money.

         So one item that the city did note, which is infrastructure

    related, is the photo on the most left on this slide, which is the

    service entrance for the electrical.  It's sitting on the second

    floor.  It's listing, its location is no longer code compliant.

    There are things like that, and that was noticed in the condemnation

    report from the City of Tucson.

         Did that clarify?  Okay.

         >> MR. GREG TAYLOR:  Another question there, so just to crosswalk

    these two presentations, and this might be for the chancellor, but

    you might be able to answer it, so in that letter that went in with





    the grant that we were talking about a second ago, I'm noticing

    programming similarities.

         So there were things that were mentioned that the college was

    committing to in that grant thing that went in that sounded like

    there intended to be housed in these buildings, so again, I'm trying

    to tie these together in my brain.

         So if we don't do this, just for the sake of conversation, if we

    weren't to pursue this adaptive reuse strategy, is there a plan B for

    honoring that commitment, or do we need to do this in order to

    fulfill that commitment that we made in there?

         >> Brandye:  We are working on a plan B.  We have two different

    spaces at the Downtown Campus that we'd like to visit with the City

    of Tucson to see if they would be appropriate for meeting their

    needs.

         The really great thing is that the workforce development, the

    diversity, equity, and inclusion, the -- gosh, the innovation center,

    and there is one more.  What's the other one?  The learning center.

    All of those have similar needs, along with what the City of Tucson

    is proposing, and it's going to get turned into a thing called a

    one-stop center.  Then that one-stop center allows for our community

    members to come and go to one place and find their needs being met in

    that one place.

         Yes, we are looking at two places -- is it Thursday?  This

    Thursday.  It's for the one-stop place.

         By the way, the word I was looking for was "condemned."





         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Thank you both.  We appreciate you being

    here.

         >> Brandye:  Thank you so much.

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Then our fourth presentation is from Ken

    Scoville and a group of his fellow -- enthusiasts?  Partners?

         >> Well, I would have to say historic preservation advocates.

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Thank you.

         >> Chair Riel, members of the board, Chancellor Lambert, thank

    you for the time of day and thank you for setting this up.

         I think just to give you a quick little background, some of you

    have different understandings of why this became a historic district

    and all this, I will just try and give you an idea.  People in Tucson

    would come here on foot, wagons, stagecoach, train, airplane, but

    probably no other medium than the automobile has so greatly impacted

    Tucson in the 20th Century.  Miracle Mile is the northern gateway,

    automobile gateway into the Tucson.

         Really, as people started exploring and coming out west, the

    first real connection was the Old Spanish Trail Highway.  In the east

    it was US90 and in the west US80.  As you can see, it would go

    through Tucson and through this way and essentially down Stone as it

    came into downtown and would head to the north.

         Let me get the laser pointer going here.  Here is a nice map of

    Tucson 1930.  You can see the City of Tucson is not even Grant Road

    yet.  Population is about 33,000, and you can see our two major

    really outlying corridors, Oracle Road and also Casa Grande Highway.





         This idea of the Miracle Mile project was there were so many

    accidents and issues going on that -- and here it is, the Casa Grande

    Highway, 1930s.  That building you're seeing there is still the

    building that exists today over to there.  You can see pretty much

    out in the country, and lots of people were coming in exploring

    automobiles and staying in different places.

         There were a lot of automobile accidents.  So this became the

    first divided highway in Arizona in Tucson to have this evolving.

    Probably several different meetings for the idea of a Miracle Mile,

    but probably the real estate people saw this was going to be a

    miracle development.  We already had this divided road in, and it was

    going to really boom.

         Now you get a good vantage point of that divided roadway.  This

    would become a major corridor for growth, just like the automobile

    is, and so many locations in Tucson.

         Here's another aerial, and now we are looking south and you can

    see the northern traffic circle.  At one time there was one on the

    southern end.  And you can see the development and things evolving at

    the time.

         Here's the heyday, the very late 1960s, you can see the total

    buildout of Miracle Mile.  When the City of Tucson decided to start

    taking traffic on interstate/freeway and rezoning motels along the

    freeway, this started the downslide of Miracle Mile that was the

    heyday entrance for the automobile.  You can see the multitude of

    motor courts and businesses.





         Especially for this group and the board's consideration, this is

    the Frontier right near and here the El Rancho.  The Tucson Inn has

    not arrived yet till a little bit in the '60s.  One of the things to

    think about not only are they important individually but they are

    important together as the street scape, the historic landscape of

    these motor courts is a defining element.  Just like downtown at the

    Congress Hotel, it defines the arrival of the railroad and the

    Congress Hotel is a railroad hotel.

         Here we have motor courts.  People wanted to have their car as

    close to them as possible so they could go out and explore with it

    and the freedom of the open road and the development of Tucson in the

    west.

         Just as a suggestion, and I'm getting confused and I have been

    involved in lots of historic preservation projects, all the numbers

    flying and all the estimates and all those other things, but the

    Tucson Inn is just "the" recognizable landmark of all the motor

    courts, motor hotels other than maybe the Ghost Ranch Lodge.  This

    begs to be some kind of hotel/restaurant venue, and this is a way of

    avoiding some of the costs if you could get a partner, a responsible

    restaurant in partnership in Tucson to take this over and help with

    the revitalization and the cost of it.

         When you look at the other two motor courts, you've got all this

    space in between that you can put obviously a contemporary building

    that would be sympathetic in a way to the architecture -- that's left

    up to the architects -- but you have plenty other space to work on to





    do infill but still saving the actual motor courts for different

    usages.

         Just recently I did a preservation for the last remaining

    department store downtown on Stone.  It's now the sort of

    entrepreneurship innovation center for the U of A, which is at the

    old Montgomery Ward's building on Stone.

         They have adaptively reused all that space.  There is a ton of

    space there for the students' needs and entrepreneurship and

    technology and working together.  This would be one of those motor

    courts, because I have had a lot of people say, I'd like to do a

    start-up business, I need some kind of space to start running my

    business out of.  These little rooms would be excellent opportunities

    for that.  There is all kinds of possibilities.

         It's just like, and what I want to address today, is how do we

    think?  How do we think about things?  As I travel around the country

    and visit historic districts and areas all across the United States,

    the main thing that makes areas get revitalized are the historic

    places in the community.

         I went to the Gaslamp District back in the '70s and '80s in

    San Diego.  If you have been there now, it's the most popular

    thriving business economic development in all of San Diego.  It used

    to be worse than Miracle Mile at its worst.

         So this is the way things happen and evolve.  Downtown is almost

    finished.  Miracle Mile and the historic resources will become very

    valuable in the very, very near future.





         Two other things.  I spent three years at the Ghost Ranch Lodge,

    a much larger project.  That was $15 million, again, years ago, but

    they had to actually rebuild rooms and structures.  The developer was

    just so happy, they wanted to level, that he kept this and it's one

    of the most important properties in their whole portfolio.

         And you want to think about The Tucson House is also a historic

    building and all the issues.  If you notice in this parking picture

    here, bad timing by the businesses.  This was supposed to be "the"

    place in Tucson for high-rise development.  But as the economy and

    change and the changes in patterns of the freeway, that would turn

    into the issues that it has now.

         So hopefully you take a different perspective and think about how

    historic resources and historic places are the key to adaptive

    reuses.

         Thank you very much.  Next presenter coming now will be Carlos

    Lozano.

         (Applause.)

         >> Thank you, Madam Chair and board members and chancellor, for

    allowing us the time to speak.  I think Ken did really well with the

    images, but if anyone does not know what these properties once looked

    like in their heyday, my images all came from the Internet.  So you

    can go to the Internet and you really need to see the beauty of these

    buildings.

         What I just wanted to say then is that if we believe that culture

    and heritage and history are important to our lives, our community,





    and to our society as a whole, if we believe that is true, then that

    can create a certain responsibility of stewardship.

         For example, there are important archaeological sites in

    extremely remote areas whose only protection is the closest rancher.

    And the rancher didn't ask for that responsibility.  They sort of

    inherited it just by using that land.  But in many cases they

    shoulder that responsibility, and they do it for generation upon

    generation, protecting those sites.

         Another example that we see all the time is when the city or the

    state, for instance, does a road widening and they have to purchase

    properties.  Well, if there are cultural resources on those

    properties, they become responsible for them.  They really should do

    the right thing with those resources even though they didn't intend

    to inherit them.

         So I understand that the current board is sort of inheriting

    these buildings that it may or may not have asked for, but I believe

    you're inheriting a moral duty to do the right thing.  It's not a

    legal duty; it's a moral duty to the community.

         The good news is is that unlike an archaeological site or a

    mural, for instance, the Drachman motels can be used productively.

    And as was mentioned, adaptive reuse ideas could be fast-tracked to

    actually begin to produce benefit very quickly and even income.

    There are people in this room and also people who sent in comments

    that that's their specialty is adaptive reuse.

         I don't even know if you can imagine some of the adaptive reuse





    projects that we have seen.  They are just really impressive.  You

    would not imagine them.  So I think you would find some of these

    projects very impressive and inspiring, and you would not have

    thought about them.

         I will just close by reminding you of this moral imperative to

    preserve our heritage and also remind you that local governments and

    public institutions that serve the community are sort of held to a

    higher standard than that of just the average developer.

         I believe that in the end you will do the right thing, and you'll

    be glad that you did and you'll be proud of the finished project.

    You'll find, I believe, that it was not as hard as you anticipated,

    and I think you'll find that it won't be as expensive as what you

    thought, as well.

         I hope to be at the ribbon-cutting ceremony.  Thank you.  Thank

    you very much, and thanks again for allowing me to speak.

         (Applause.)

         >> Chancellor Lambert and Pima Community College Board.  Thank

    you so much for allowing me to speak.  My name is JJ Lamb.  I'm with

    the Vail Preservation Society.  I'd just like to talk to you a little

    bit about the incredible opportunities for education that an adaptive

    reuse project can really provide.

         I'll also share that I was born in Tucson.  I live in Vail now,

    but this is the area of town that I grew up in.  I'll just say I have

    an affinity and a love for the sense of place that these structures

    can provide.  Not just during my childhood but for the neighborhood





    that lives there now.

         So what you're looking at in this slide is the 1915 Section

    Foreman House, and this is a railroad house that Vail Preservation

    Society purchased and moved to the Esmond Station School.  The Esmond

    Station School site has a section of rail line that bisects the site,

    and the site council really wanted to showcase that history and help

    provide a sense of place.  And we're looking for how can we do that

    and how can that adaptive reuse, that sense of place, really serve

    education?

         And this is really where I think Pima Community College is.  How

    can these buildings serve education?  Because that's what they need

    to do.

         What we did, through a partnership, we looked for ways that the

    building could actually provide hands-on experiential learning.  It

    took, because we engaged high school students in the construction

    tech program, so I'm just going to put out there that not only can

    the building serve education when their adaptively reused and that

    process is completed, you can use that process effectively to provide

    hands-on experiential learning for your students in your program,

    make this process part of the learning process, as well.

         So we have had students -- there is hundreds of students really

    that over the five years that it took to rehab the building, and it

    takes a little longer, but you're actually providing real

    experiences.  We are a little -- our theme was Lifelong Learning With

    Local Impact.  So not only are the students gaining experience.  They





    are doing something real that they know is giving back to their

    community.  Not just now but into the future.

         So we have had students that went on to become architects.  We

    have had students that learned through that adaptive reuse process

    how to incorporate modern mechanical systems.  We have students that

    went on and they are making great salaries, installing HVAC and those

    kinds of things.  We have students that went on to become very

    successful and sought-after welders.

         We have students who learned how to restore historic windows.

    And actually I'll just say that this is historic preservation

    research study that Vail Preservation Society in with the University

    of Arizona and other partners, and as we were in the process of this

    study, we discovered that there were four simultaneous similar

    studies happening around the country.  That's because there is a real

    need for the skills that students learn.  There is a shortage of

    individuals with the real skills needed to do adaptive reuse and to

    restore historic properties.

         This is just one of the many classes that worked on the building.

    Right now, and I will just give you a couple of quick details, really

    the average age of a person with the real skills that you need to

    work on one of these buildings, they are like 60, 65 years old.

    There's a huge gap.

         So there is an opportunity here for Pima Community College to

    really take a visionary step and incorporate into, you know,

    restoring and adaptively reusing these buildings.  Not just the





    viewscape and the sense of place, which I think is important, but

    also real concrete learning opportunities.

         I think too when we think about sustainability, because we're not

    thinking about the 20th Century, we're faced with real sustainability

    issues that the students that I work with -- and this building

    continues to be used.  Right now it's in the center of campus, it's

    an active part of learning.

         One of the things that Vail Preservation Society continues to do

    is to host a museum club.  The children, fourth grade through eighth

    grade, they learn about historic preservation, they learn about

    sustainability, they learn about their local heritage.

         What I hear back from a lot of them is that understanding about

    the place that you live helps them feel more at home and connected

    and really understanding how to adaptively reuse a building, not just

    shove it into the landfill, not just release more carbon into the

    atmosphere.  It makes them think about sustainability in a very

    different way.  And that's another opportunity that you have.

         Sustainability is a key issue for our future, and I think that

    this is a project that also links to that.  It inspires people to do

    their best.  A lot of the students in the construction tech course,

    you know, when they started working on this building, they weren't

    really necessarily thinking about being an architect or even going on

    to Pima Community College or university.

         But working on this project inspired them to do that.  That's

    part of what inspired me to participate in this preservation trades,





    because I wanted to be part of finding the data to show that there

    really are jobs out there and there are connections.

         So I would say the project that you're considering that would

    continue to provide a sense of place also could be an inspiration and

    quite a visionary project for Pima Community College to participate

    in.  And it's much more inspiring than a parking lot.

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Great.  Thank you so much.

         (Applause.)

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Ken, will you and the people who spoke fill

    out one of our cards so we can get in contact with you and have a

    record that you spoke?  Thank you so much.

         A lot of you weren't here when we first started this, so if you

    are interested in speaking, there are call-to-the-audience cards in

    the back, and you'll need to fill out one of those before you come up

    here to speak.

         Once again, we're going to be done by 6:00, so we only have 55

    minutes left.  We are going to hold each person's comments to three

    minutes.  Be respectful and enjoy what people are saying.  Be an

    active listener so we can all learn as much as possible from these

    comments.

         If someone has already said exactly or close to what you're going

    to say, if you would defer your time and give it to somebody else who

    has some more information or ideas for the board to understand so we

    can make the best decision possible down the road when this happens.

         So thank you so much for being here.





         We're going to start with Julie Ann Lamrey, I think.  Our

    timekeeper is set.  There are lights up here that they'll see, I

    think.

         Go ahead.  Thank you.

         >> It's Julie Ann Lamrey.  And I'm one of the owners of 210 West

    Drachman Street.  We're your neighbor.  I wanted to say when we

    purchased this property, it looked very similar to a lot of the

    images you have up there.

         We did find that we were able to reuse, recycle, and repurpose a

    lot of the materials on-site.  There was a tremendous job ahead of us

    to do that, but we are very happy to be part of this community.

    We're interested also in how to engage and support building that

    community.

         Much of my ideas have already been stated, so I will go ahead and

    pass my time forward, but I wanted to say thank you so much for this

    opportunity to connect and to share the work that you're doing.  We

    are very excited to be a partner in this neighborhood.  So thank you.

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Thank you.

         Our next speaker is Christina Scholls.

         >> Hi there.  My name is Christina Scholls.  I am the president

    of the Bronx Park Neighborhood Association.  I'm echoing one of our

    members, Julie Ann, who just spoke.  Thank you, thank you, for what

    Pima has been doing in our neighborhood.

         We reinvigorated our neighborhood association back in 2017 as a

    response, as basically inspired by what we were seeing in Pima.  We





    see you guys as a leader, as an asset to our neighborhood.  And as we

    bring in the next generation of residents and for those who are

    currently living there, it's really important that we see ourselves

    reflected in what happens on Drachman.  What I have heard from the

    city, what I have heard from Pima and some of the ideas put forward

    by our historical preservation advocates, it makes my heart sing.  It

    makes me very hopeful for our future.

         As a representative of an area where we have been disadvantaged

    where there are real inequities around economic development, around

    ecological development, to echo what Carlos said, there is a moral

    imperative, and we stand by you as advocates and as partners where we

    are ready when called upon, and we are very excited to see what you

    can bring.

         Thank you very much.

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Thank you, Christina.

         Bill Christy.  Is Bill Christy here?

         We will move to our list.  These are people who registered online

    for our meeting.  I'm not sure if you're present or if you're going

    to be on a Zoom call, so we'll give you a chance either way.

         Alexander Hassle.  Is Alexander here?

         Alexander's comment was keep the library.  Thank you, Alexander.

    And if you're online and we don't get to you right now we will come

    back to you if you're here.

         Our next person that registered online is Rhonda Graham.

         Okay.  Our next person who registered is Starla Celine.  Starla's





    comment was hello, as a former graduate of PCC's veterinary

    technology program, one of the best programs available in the state,

    it would be a great disservice to this outstanding program -- oh.  I

    think that was from the...  I don't think she was talking about the

    hotel properties.

         But our vet tech program is amazing.  (Laughter.)

         Makyla Hays.

         >> MAKYLA HAYS:  Good evening, board members, Chancellor,

    colleagues and guests.  My name is Makyla Hays.  I'm faculty, PCCEA

    president, and AERC co-chair.  I want to talk tonight about

    priorities before I share my thoughts about the future of the hotel

    properties.

         We have heard in the last couple of Governing Board budget

    presentations about large capital projects currently in place or

    which are needed in short-term future to continue to serve the

    students we currently have.

         At West Campus, a health professions center of excellence is not

    yet online, and there is a second project upgrade for the science lab

    areas on that campus, as well.  Both projects have budgetary

    commitments still to come.

         The 29th Street Coalition Center has issues with the HVAC system,

    and there are future plans to move that center to East Campus with

    updated facilities.  As we heard at the last meeting, this needs to

    be done with careful planning and collaboration, but I think most

    people see the necessity of it.  A center of excellence for public





    safety, PSESI, most likely at the East Campus would be an opportunity

    to continue to serve students and perhaps even grow enrollment for

    those areas.  The proposals for these options were not small amounts

    of money.

         Facilities also recently presented a large list of deferred

    maintenance that needs to be done throughout the college.  Some of

    these projects are scheduled to get done this coming year, but there

    is more to be done than the budget will allow.  Likely there will be

    needed investments over the next few years to address the list of

    deferred maintenance items.

         While I love preserving history, my husband's grandfather was

    actually one of the first professors here at Pima, while I love it

    and it's moving to see the passion this community has for these

    properties, I'm struggling to see the justification of spending

    millions of dollars on these properties if they won't directly impact

    and serve our students, or if they negatively impact our ability to

    make progress on other important projects.

         Are there possibilities for grants or partnerships that would

    offset significant costs of restoring these buildings that would not

    detract from our other projects?  For years I have heard about the

    idea of potentially closing the District Office here and moving

    district staff to campuses.

         To that end, could these new spaces house our District Office

    employees to move us in that direction without greatly increasing our

    operating expenses?





         I see that one of the other options for these properties is

    parking.  Is that a current need for our students?  I know we have

    two other centers of excellence at that campus.  Are we projecting

    that there is an issue?

         If we were to move other employees such as district employees

    into renovated buildings, would there be a projected issue?  It would

    be a shame to see the properties turn into parking if that isn't

    meeting the needs of the community or campus.

         I want to thank the board for thoughtfully considering their

    options, and I thank the community for showing passion for history

    and Tucson culture.  I look forward to hearing how whatever plan is

    chosen will serve our students and our community, and I hope the

    community group's passion about these projects could find a way to

    partner with PCC to work on funding these projects so the college can

    continue with other important projects, as well.  Thanks.

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Thank you, Makyla.

         I've got another list.  So we will have lots more speakers.

    Thank you.  Dirk Arnold.

         >> Hi there.  Thank you for having this meeting tonight.  I'm

    Dirk Arnold, and I recently purchased a house at the corner of

    Drachman and Stone, in part because I saw that Pima Community College

    was interested in bringing this neighborhood up a little bit more

    than it has been in the past.  So I would hate to see that impression

    that the community has that the community college is interested in

    doing something suddenly be cast aside.





         On Instagram when the Tucson Inn sign was relit, just from my own

    personal experience, Pima Community College got a lot of positive PR

    for that, and also because people are saying, oh, and also, they are

    not just fixing up this old sign, they are going to fix up the

    building as well.

         I just thought you ought to keep those things in mind.  Thank you

    very much.

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Thank you.  Tim Hagyard.

         >> Here.  Hi.  My name is Tim Hagyard, and I'm a neighbor of Pima

    College, I live over in Dunbar Spring, a native Tucsonan.  And I

    think it would just be a huge missed opportunity for the community if

    those buildings went away.

         The Downtown Campus is not known for its architecture or -- so

    it's a great community thing if you're going to Pima Community

    College.  This is an outward face of Pima Community College that can

    reconnect the rest of the community in a way that I don't think

    you're going to be able to do with just the students that go there.

         So I think you've taken on a responsibility with the community by

    taking on these properties.  If that's not something you're up to, I

    think you should give them back to the community to do something

    with.

         We don't need another parking lot.  We have enough parking lots.

    If you want parking lots, you know, there is buses, there's shuttles,

    that sort of stuff.  That's all I have to say.  Thank you very much.

         (Applause.)





         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Thank you.

         We're going to go to some more of these names.  Steve MacKie.

         What about Richard O?  How about Robert Vint?  Jude and Monica

    Cook.

         >> Hello.

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  We will come back to Robert in a moment

    since we have two more people walking down.

         >> My name is Monica Cook.  Together we have two businesses.  One

    of them is Ignite Sign Art Museum.  People that come to a museum come

    to see historic signs, and then they want to know what other ones are

    around Tucson.

         So we always send them over to the Neon Walk.  Then they also

    want to know other ones.  They like to stay in boutique hotels.  They

    like to stay in mid-century places, because they come to Tucson for

    the culture.

         You guys have a great opportunity here with the motels.  You also

    have programs that would support it.  You have culinary in your

    program.  You have motel management.  Why not make these student-run

    motels and do your training there?  Then also what someone said

    earlier, use your programs to do the HVAC and train your students.

         >> Thank you.  I appreciate the chance to talk.  I do want to say

    I really appreciate what Pima College does with workforce development

    in this city.  Boy, do we need it.

         These buildings are crucial to the Thrive in the 05 project.  It

    would be an error in judgment to rip these things down.  I suggest,





    as I think JJ said, was to look at partnerships to help develop this.

    The redevelopment of these properties would be a boom to that entire

    area, and that's the whole purpose of the Thrive in the 05.  You

    know, we are trying to bring it back.  You rip this down, you're

    going to end up with anytown anywhere.  And one of the things we've

    got going is the history.  Tucson seems to appreciate the history, as

    we can see with the turnout here tonight.

         Parking?  Really?  I'm down there a lot, and that north lot is

    never full.  With the amount of online classes you've got going, I

    don't think we need more parking lots.  We need vision, guys.

         Thank you.

         (Applause.)

         >> Also, Jude is one of the companies that restored the Tucson

    Inn sign, so we hope you're going to restore the Frontier Inn too

    eventually and make that whole area light up.

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Thank you.  Yeah, they are great-looking

    signs.  You guys did a great job.  Thank you.

         Robert is online.  Robert Vint.

         >> Hi.  Bob Vint.  I'm also a native Tucsonan, as are many of the

    speakers here this evening.  I also highly value Pima Community

    College.  It's a great community institution.  It helps a great many

    students advance in their careers and their lives.

         In fact, one of my young associates in my architectural office

    did three years at Pima before transferring to the University of

    Arizona to get his degree.  It was more affordable, more flexible.





    It's a great, great thing.

         One thing we do need in terms of workforce development, we need

    architects, also need plasterers, tradesmen, craftsman.  I know there

    is a training program that's being discussed between U of A and Pima

    to start building a cadre of preservation-trained craftsmen.

    Something very important, as has been observed, those of us in the

    field are getting rather long in the tooth and it's getting to be

    time to train that next generation.  These buildings will make the

    perfect project to turn into a training program and build that next

    cadre of preservationists.

         So I urge you to consider all options, and once again, thanks for

    the opportunity to speak.

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Thank you.  Our next speaker is Herb

    Stratford.

         >> Thank you, Chancellor, Chair, members of the board.  My name

    is Herb Stratford.  I'm a 40-year Tucson resident and preservation

    professional and advocate.  I live in a 1907 house.  I restored an

    1880s building downtown, along with the 1929 Fox Tucson Theater.  I'm

    currently restoring the 1915 Teatro Carmen in Barrio Viejo.

         I know firsthand what history means to a community and not only

    in terms of creating a sense of place but also the economic impact

    that comes from that.  But I also work all across the country as a

    historic theatre consultant.  I have worked in more than 20 states in

    the past 15 years helping communities reclaim their history via

    historic buildings.  Once these structures are gone there's no





    replacement.  Adaptive reuse is the only option for these properties.

         The power and impact of preservation on communities is nearly

    incalculable when all we have to do is look to our neighbor to the

    north to see what happens when history is absent.

         I would also like to address the proposed changes and costs of

    the project.  As a veteran of multiple award-winning historic

    preservation projects, and currently in charge of an $8 million

    project, Carmen, I'm baffled by the increase and would like to

    understand what has changed.

         I'm more than confident that creative solutions can be brought to

    bear that will limit those costs.  I gladly volunteer my time to be

    of assistance as a preservation professional if it would help save

    these structures and ensure the crucial connection between Pima

    Community College and the larger community of Tucson.

         These properties will become a magnet to the community and

    visitors alike.  That impact will not only be economic but will be

    emotional.

         You can't manufacture nostalgia, but you can get value from it.

    Authenticity is what makes communities unique and special.  Please

    don't let this opportunity go and stay the course to do the right

    thing.

         And actually, as Tim said, if you're not going to be able to

    restore the buildings, please let them go to someone who will restore

    the buildings.  Thank you very much.

         (Applause.)





         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Thank you.

         Our next speaker is Tammy Trujillo.  Tammy Trujillo.

         What about John Gerard?

         >> Hello.  This is (indiscernible).  I'm with the BCT faculty.

    I'm a discipline coordinator and representing John Gerard.  He

    couldn't make it.  He was at another meeting tonight.

          Just a quick comment.  Based on what I heard tonight in the way

    of historic preservation and adaptive reuse, I'm a licensed architect

    in the State of Arizona and a faculty member with the BCT department,

    and we just want to offer up that we are in support of whatever the

    board decides here and happy to serve in any way we can to assist the

    community as well as our student learning in this opportunity.

         Thank you.

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Great.  Thank you.

         Next up, Alvero Gevara.  What about Laura Tabili?

         >> Hi.  I'm here also to urge the PCC board to recommit to

    restoring and adaptively reusing the three Drachman motels.  I'm

    reading my comments.

         I think repurposing these landmark properties for use,

    particularly for student learning, as has been suggested by several

    people, will pay triple dividends.  It will help to educate PCC

    students in these construction trades.

         They will attract tourists during and after, right?  And they

    will serve as an economic engine to revitalize the Miracle Mile

    District and the 05, which is an ongoing project.





         I really thought our community had learned the lessons of the

    tragic razing of downtown's La Calle, and I agree with Jude Cook that

    the last thing we need is more of Tucson's cultural heritage

    bulldozed for parking lots, which seems very counterproductive.

         Tucson's climate plan calls for expanded public transportation

    including the Norte-Sur line that we just heard about earlier in the

    meeting that is going to connect, it's going to go right past the

    campus with a stop at Drachman.

         And of course the city council just voted to make public

    transportation free indefinitely, so really those parking lots may

    well be obsolete before they're even created and that would be

    tragic.

         So I think the estimated cost needs to be looked into.  It seems

    a little suspicious that it skyrocketed so much, although I know that

    construction has gone up.  I think the board might want to look into

    those figures a little bit more.

         I could say more about the value of each property.  The Tucson

    Inn, which was designed by Ann Rysdale, who was the first woman

    chartered, licensed as an architect in Arizona and bears her

    distinctive style, and that's another story I won't go into because I

    would like to let other people's voices be heard.

         But again, I respectively urge the board to recommit to adaptive

    reuse of these fascinating and evocative cultural resources.

         Thank you for hearing me.

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Thank you, Laura.





         Our next speaker will be Raul Ramirez.

         >> Thank you, Board Chair and Mr. Lambert, for the opportunity to

    address you today.  I'm kind of the odd bird here because most of the

    people here are advocating for the historic preservation of those

    buildings, and I would say that this is not Pima's strength,

    honestly.

         But I'll tell you a little bit about where I have been.  One of

    the buildings that I did get involved in in trying to preserve was

    Mares College, and we met with the bishop, and this was when I was

    involved with El Presidio.

         The bishop shared that his advisors that included Jim Click and

    Bert Lopez had advised him that it was cheaper to knock the building

    down and build a new.  But you know what?  He stuck to his guns.  He

    worked and it was kind of a creative energy that took place with a

    firm from Phoenix called the Foundation for Senior Living.

         They included the building that the diocese had.  They tore that

    one down and built senior living and then repurposed the Mares

    College.

         So I think something like that creative could happen, but I just

    see that this is going to be an albatross on the neck of Pima

    College.

         I was glad to see Ann, and I think she left, Ann Chanecka from

    the city, because right now the city is working on several projects,

    and they have been mentioned here.  One of them is the transit

    housing which Norte-Sur is one of them.





         What I think could be done and without that much cost would be to

    sell the buildings to a developer that would then turn them into

    affordable housing.  In Tucson we have a great need and Ann also

    talked about the need.  Thrive in the 05.  The community around there

    is called Barrio Blue Moon.

         I was at a meeting with city hall when they were talking about

    the IID, Infill Incentive District, and they were thinking about that

    grant that the city was going for for 50 million, and they said it's

    vital to be part of the infill incentive.

         It seems to me that the key components are really there and Pima

    could disinvest herself from that obligation and yet preserve the

    buildings with somebody that would be willing to do it and provide a

    service in the community.

         One last thing about Pima College.  My mother graduated in '75

    around the same time that I was getting my master's from ASU.  My

    grandson graduated last year.  It took him a little longer because a

    lot of the classes were not available at the time that he wanted to

    take them.

         So there is still a lot of need for Pima College to strengthen

    your programs, and I would say there is a lot of deferred maintenance

    that you have to deal with.  Thank you.

         (Applause.)

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Thank you.

         Molly McKasson via Zoom.

         >> Thank you, Chairwoman, Chancellor, board, everyone gathered.





    I'm a long-time Tucsonan.  My family came here probably down Miracle

    Mile at some point coming from Iowa in 1958.

         I just want to thank everyone for the serious consideration of a

    project that just seems like it could be transformative for this part

    of town.

         So much has been said.  I don't have to repeat it.  There have

    been some beautiful things brought up about the learning

    opportunities, the workforce development, all sorts of things that

    could go into the adaptive reuse and the reconstructing of these

    historic buildings.

         I for one would really be excited about the welding program.  I

    have a scholarship that I set up at Pima in my husband's name, a

    welding scholarship, and I know that that kind of work would be

    really needed in this project, as well as electricians, obviously,

    some really challenging electrical problems.  What better place to

    learn them than right there.

         Pima College has been exemplary for hands-on education.  I think

    this is such a beautiful opportunity.  And it being a gateway into

    the downtown, it just further integrates Pima College into the life

    of the community.  Not just the present life but the past and the

    future.

         So I submitted some other comments, too.  But I just mostly want

    to say, oh, please, let's not let this opportunity go by.  Thank you

    very much.

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Thank you.





         Next on the list is Teresita Majewski.

         >> Thank you, Madam Chair, Chancellor, and board members for this

    opportunity to speak briefly.  I did want to give my thanks to Ken

    Scoville, Carlos Lozano, JJ Lamb, Tim Hagyard, they're all members of

    the Tucson Pima County Historical Commission.  They provided useful

    background on Miracle Mile and historic preservation and adaptive

    reuse.

         I'm chair of the commission, but I'm out of town for health

    reasons.  I wanted to just mention a few things.  In 2021 the

    commission wrote to congratulate and commend Pima Community College

    for its decision to adaptively reuse the three historic motels on

    Drachman.

         At that point in time, the decision to purchase and adaptively

    reuse the buildings just added to your exemplary record at that time,

    historic preservation and contemporary placement on its campuses and

    as a central player within the community.

         In April of this year we followed up asking to creatively

    repurpose these buildings instead of demolishing them.  I just wanted

    to say that if it's not something you can do, I really encourage

    selling the buildings to someone who can do it, and, you know,

    understanding your mission and all those things.

         Thank you very much for this opportunity to speak, and thank you

    to the other advocates who added wonderful suggestions and solutions.

    Thank you.

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Thank you.  Next speaker, Nancy Defayo.





         What about Eric Schmoll?

         JJ Lamb?

         >> DR. LEE LAMBERT:  She already spoke.

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  She already spoke?

         William Bird.

         >> Honorable Board, Chancellor Lambert, Chair Riel.  Thank you

    for holding this public study session today to hear from the

    community.

         My name is William Lawrence Bird, and for many years I worked as

    a curator at the Smithsonian in Washington before returning to Tucson

    where I received an MA in history from the University of Arizona in

    the mid '70s, and I'm pleased to speak to the board this evening.

         We are kind of in the public education campaign too of the Tucson

    Historic Preservation Foundation and its thousands of dedicated

    members on whose board I sit and am representing here this evening.

         A lot of this I have struck from my little talk because it's

    already been covered, but there are a couple of points that I wish to

    bring up that have not yet been brought up.

         First I'd like to remind everyone of the extraordinary

    collaborative work that took place between the historic preservation

    foundation and Pima Community College.  Second, the college's decade

    of leadership in helping to revitalize the Oracle area that's under

    discussion here.

         Between 2009 and 2012, Pima Community College and the Tucson

    Historic Preservation Foundation partnered to make the creative Neon





    Art Walk that you see along Drachman today.  College Administrator

    Jason Brown represented PCC and served as co-chair of the citizens

    steering committee.

         The preservation foundation raised over $150,000 through small

    community donations, and these funds were utilized for the

    restoration and installation of four classic signs which were

    generously donated to the college and placed on the northern edge of

    the campus.

         This project garnered national press attention and received a

    preservation honor award from the Arizona governor.  Pima Community

    College was not merely an active participant.  The college was a

    leader in revitalization initiatives in the area for over a decade.

         The proposed restoration of the Tucson Inn, Frontier and El

    Rancho buildings further solidifies the college's commitment to the

    community and the work in this area consistent with its center of

    excellence and hospitality leadership that supports the growth of

    Tucson's travel and tourism industry.

         These buildings were listed on the National Register of Historic

    Places when the college acquired them, emphasizing their historical

    significance.  And the board at that time understood that restoration

    and adaptive reuse to house college programs was the intended purpose

    as they were purchasing the properties.

         I just want to conclude with a word about the economics and

    frankly the politics of adaptive reuse, which we believe is truly a

    win-win situation.





         Thanks for your time.

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Thank you.

         (Applause.)

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Next on our list is Alex Lim on Zoom.

         >> Hello.  Thank you.  Thank you for this opportunity.  I live in

    Nogales, Arizona, but I recognize some of the names that spoke up

    their minds today.

         The sense of identity that Tucson has, and as a newcomer to

    Arizona over 10 years now, it's incredible.  I think Pima Community

    College can really be a leader in galvonizing the energy into seeing

    the community that people who live in Pima County and Tucson do

    really enjoy and be proud of.

         I understand the cost that was debated.  It came out high.  I'm

    sure there's a way to either bring it down somehow or to, like many

    members mentioned today, handing off the property to somebody or some

    entity who can actually realize, that reflects the community's

    wishes.

         So I just want to say thank you for this incredible opportunity

    to really listen to the community members, what they have in mind,

    how they feel about the places.

         Best of luck.

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Thank you.

         Next, Hope Hennessey

         >> Hello.  My name is Hope Hennessey.  I live downtown.  My son

    attended Pima Community College, and we're all grateful for that





    opportunity he had.

         I urge you to listen to all of these creative solutions.  I hear

    regret that the purchase was made, but it was made, and with that

    comes responsibility.  So please take advantage of all of these great

    ideas, and anything else will lead to regret.  I see no other path

    but to regret.

         Thank you.

         (Applause.)

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Thank you.  Kiley Walzak.

         >> Hi.  This is Kiley Walzak.  I didn't sign up to speak.  I'm

    listening on behalf of District 2 Supervisor Matt Heinz.

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Thanks, Kiley.

         Carlos Lozano.  Already left?  Oh, you spoke already.  Thank you.

    Did you fill out a card?  Will you fill out a card for me, please?

    Thank you.

         Philip Zimmerman.  Online?  Thank you.

         >> I actually didn't want to speak.  I just signed up to observe

    the proceedings.

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Thank you.  We appreciate you being here.

         Ben Lepley.  What about Michael Lepley?

         Marcia Spark?  Jennifer Levstick?

         How about Savannah McDonald?

         >> Good evening, Chancellor, Chair, and Board.  I'm a member of

    the Tucson Pima County Historic Commission, but I speak as a citizen.

    I'm also a principal architect with a local firm and specialize in





    design for Southern Arizona communities historic preservation,

    adaptive reuse, and affordable multifamily housing.  I appreciate the

    opportunity to voice comments and recommendations on this important

    topic.

         These three historic Drachman hotels contribute to the Miracle

    Mile Historic District and importantly to the greater Tucson

    community sense of place and continuous story.

         The existing structures can absolutely be revived with the

    creative and preservationist approach to design that allows the

    buildings to function to meet new modern needs while maintaining

    their iconic and character-defining features that provide reminders

    of our heritage but can also serve as examples of our approach to

    Tucson's future.

         As former AIA President Carl Elefante said, the most sustainable

    building is the one that is already built.  I would encourage

    consideration, even apart from the historic nature of these

    buildings, on the effect of our environment, the energy waste of

    tearing down these sturdy buildings and materials to pile up in a

    landfill, and the role and stance of Pima Community College on these

    issues.

         As someone who is currently working on design for adaptive reuse

    of both the Amazon and the No-Tel Motel projects into affordable

    housing to begin to address the overwhelming affordable housing

    shortage and blight issues while protecting and upholding the

    qualities and features of these unique places, I understand the





    enormous challenges you are faced with such a project.

         I encourage you to dig deeper into the potential of preservation

    and highly recommend consulting with builders who are local,

    well-experienced, expert, and specifically with this type of work to

    gain accurate cost insight and realistic feedback to inform your

    decision-making process.

         I would also encourage a careful view of the greater value of

    these properties to our community and the influential and vibrant

    possibilities that a thoughtful adaptive reuse project would present

    here.

         Thank you.

         (Applause.)

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Thank you.

         Next on our list is David Smith.

         >> Thanks to you all for organizing this and letting us vent

    ourselves in front of you.

         Every time I go to visit the Presidio Park in downtown Tucson, I

    think how great this is, it's really fantastic, but how much greater

    it would have been had more of it survived to the present day.

         I'm a city planner by training.  I have worked for more decades

    that I care to recall in the U.S. and overseas.  I have also

    project-managed reuse and restoration of several national historic

    register properties.  I understand the challenges and difficulties.

    Costs are always rising.  Building codes are changing and becoming

    more complex.





         Fitting use into an older building can present challenges.  It

    takes a lot of persistence, commitment, creative financing and just a

    lot of effort to make a project turn out properly.

         But it can be done.  It's done all the time everywhere throughout

    the country.  It just takes the resolve on the part of the owner, the

    technicians, and the specialists who work on the project, and the

    community.

         My wife and I have lived here in Pima County for over 20 years.

    We have taken courses at the West Campus.  I have been very impressed

    with the entire Pima College network and the opportunities that it

    presents to all of the citizens of the county and the educational

    opportunities that can be realized.  The students, the faculty, the

    facilities at the West Campus where I'm most familiar are fantastic.

         But it's not just the educational experiences in the classroom

    that matter.  This institution as a whole, through the board,

    delivers messages to the community by what you decide and what

    actions you take.

         If these buildings are erased, they can cannot be replaced, and

    that will be a very strong message to the community which I think

    would be highly regrettable.

         So thank you.

         (Applause.)

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Bobby Joe Buehl Carter.

         >> Thank you for this opportunity.  I have lived downtown for 42

    years now in the barrio.  When I first moved in, people asked me why





    would you want to live there?  I will say it's taken a long time, and

    now it's a neighborhood that it seems virtually everybody wants to

    live in.

         It speaks to what Tucsonans value and also what helps drive our

    economy.  This is the season where, in my neighborhood now, everybody

    is taking their high school graduation photos.  Yesterday five groups

    I saw taking their high school graduation photos.  Wedding photos,

    quinceanera photos.

         Tucsonans value the heritage of this city.  It's one of the

    reasons we want to live here.  It brings tourists.  In our

    neighborhood there are walking tours every single day of the week

    now.  There are people painting the buildings.

         You have buildings downtown that they might look like a wreck

    right now, and I grant you they do.  They look terrible.  But one of

    the things I have also done in my 42 years is my husband and I

    restored more than a dozen buildings downtown, including an apartment

    complex that, yep, it was condemned, surrounded by razor-wire fence.

         It takes a long time to see what the future might look like and

    what people might value.  But I promise you, and we won't be alive 42

    years from now probably, but the buildings you own, they will be

    valued.  That stretch of the city will come back if you don't level

    it.

         Seize the opportunity.  And if you don't have the stomach for it,

    that's fine.  Sell the properties to somebody who does value them.

         There's no harm in walking away from it.  But demolition, you





    can't reverse it.  And the parking lots, people have said it, there

    couldn't be a worse possible use.

         Thank you.

         (Applause.)

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Martin Hernandez.

         Deborah Zelnio.  Melissa Fogel?

         Katherine McKinney.  Katherine, are you there online?  Hi,

    Katherine.  We see your name.  Are you ready to speak?  Okay.  We'll

    come back to Katherine.

         Michael Edmonds.

         >> First of all, let me say I hadn't planned on speaking, but

    since my name is on the list and I got called, first of all, thank

    you all for coming.  Everybody, thank you for coming.  Thanks to the

    news media for coming.

         Let me introduce myself.  My name is Mike Edmonds, and I'm the

    former president of Tucson House, residence council, and I'm in the

    Barrio Blue Moon Neighborhood Association, because Tucson House is in

    that area.  I'm the former vice-chair of the Commission on Equitable

    Housing and Development for the City of Tucson.  I'm also ambassador

    for the high-capacity transit line.  Some call it high-speed rail.

    I'm not sure that it's been chosen yet whether it's going to be rail

    or bus.  We have been out gathering information and sharing

    information about the line.

         I'm also the community liaison for Ward 3 for Councilman Kevin

    Dahl.  Thanks, Kev.





         Quick question.  Have you all been in the Thrive in the 05 area?

    Walked around?  Okay.  I didn't know, because all I want to really

    say is I see a lot of opportunities and possibilities.  I have been

    saying that for three, maybe four years, coming up four years now on

    Tucson House, just being involved in Thrive in the 05.

         I invite you to contact me if you have any questions about the

    Thrive area, about the area you're thinking of making some changes

    to, modifications to.

         Again, just real quick, thanks, everybody, for coming.  I didn't

    expect this many people to come.  Feel free to reach out to me at the

    Ward 3 office if I can be of any assistance and help.  Thanks.

         (Applause.)

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Thank you.  Gretchen Lueck.

         >> Hi.  I'm a Pima alumni.  I'm really glad to be here tonight.

    Also live on Feldman's, which is on the other side of Stone from the

    project.

         One of the things I was most excited to hear about the project

    was the culinary piece.  We are a city of gastronomy, the first in

    the country, as we all know, and I think it would be amazing if we

    had sort of a more public culinary piece, training, maybe an open

    area where people can go and buy meals to sample some of our fabulous

    culinary expertise here.

         And the other piece of that is our restaurants here desperately

    need trained staff.  I don't know if you've been out to eat lately.

    Service is not what it used to be.  Restaurants are having to close





    for certain days and certain hours.

         As far as some of the properties, maybe they could be offices or

    dorms if not any of the aforementioned things.

         These properties, these hotels, are an integral piece of Historic

    Highway 80.  As many people have said, preservation makes a

    destination.  People are coming to Tucson partly because of our

    history as well as the natural beauty.  It just doesn't seem like

    demolition jibes with the Thrive in the 05.

         Thank you.

         (Applause.)

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Thank you.  Susan Shinn Dehetty (phonetic).

         >> Thank you so much.  I had no intention of speaking here, but I

    thought I'd throw my two cents in.

         It's the perspective I haven't heard here, and that is from the

    outside.  From the far outside.  I'm a newbie.  I have only been here

    six years.  I was the top writer at People Magazine in New York, and

    I'm originally from 8 Mile in Detroit.  I have seen communities

    change in many different ways.

         When I lived in DC, I needed to find a place to live, driving

    around, not far from where the riots had taken place in DC, 3rd and G

    Northeast.  Saw a huge, big red-brick building with turrets, all

    kinds of construction going on.  I had no idea.

         I went in, started asking questions.  It was an 1892 schoolhouse

    that had been abandoned to junkies.  A developer, very cool guy, came

    in, fixed it all up, 10-foot ceilings, batons to open up the windows,





    fireplaces.  It became one of the most extraordinary residential

    buildings in DC.  I had no idea.  It was the first adaptive reuse

    building, residential, in Washington, D.C.

         Then not too long after that I found an old house for $30,000 on

    the western shore of the Chesapeake, and a guy and I redid it.

    Scotch tape and a prayer, but we did it.

         The town that this house was in had been off limits in sailors in

    World War II.  Gambling, prostitution, horrible, everyone said, what

    are you going there for?  You're living in 3rd and G Northeast.  What

    are you doing this stuff for?  We fixed up this little house.  It was

    on the cover of The Washington Post home section.

         I'm just saying I have seen these things.  I moved out, got done

    with New York, moved out here, threw a dart at a map.  A friend of

    mine had bought some property north of town.  She said, come on,

    you've got to see this place.  I thought guys in golf pats and stuff.

    I had no idea.

         I came out here.  Someone took me to San Xavier.  I met a

    Ronstadt.  I went to Tumacacori.  I've been to refugee camps in

    Pakistan.  I've done a lot of stuff.  Wrote two New York Times best

    sellers.  And it happened within 48 hours.  I stayed at the Arizona

    Inn and looked at the history and read about Greenway and what that

    place had been.  I told my friends in New York this is as exotic and

    authentic a place as I have ever been anywhere.

         And none of them believed me.

         (Applause.)





         >> None of them believed me, and I'm sure you're all aware that

    in the space of three months, Tucson was named on the Time.com

    website -- I had worked for Time Magazine in Washington -- and also

    The New York Times as one of "the" places that you have to visit in

    2023.

         I sent it to everybody.  I put it on Facebook.  My friends all

    said, Only you, Shinn Dehetty, only you.

         So I'm in a little house in Blenman -- I have to stop?

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Yeah.

         >> Okay.

         (Applause.)

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  But Susan, that was an amazing bit that you

    shared with us, and --

         (Off mic.)

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  Okay.  We just want to thank all of you for

    being here.  We really appreciate everything you shared with us.  It

    is a decision that the board is going to have to make at some point.

         I just want to say one thing.  We never decided to put in more

    parking lots, right?  That wasn't an idea.  Please be, you know, rest

    assured that we are going to make the best decision that we can make

    that will improve student education, improve the bit of the college

    and the community.  We want to try to do it all.

         We're not sure how that will happen but we're not making this

    decision lightly.  Thank you for being here.  Keep in touch if you

    have more information you want to share with us.





         (Applause.)

         >> DR. LEE LAMBERT:  Madam Chair, I wanted to note I was

    receiving e-mails from people who were online, and I let them know

    that we will add their comments to the record.

         (Applause.)

         >> MS. THERESA RIEL:  We're going to move to adjourn this

    meeting.  Thank you for being here.  We appreciate you all.

         (Adjournment.)





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